Gody322 3 years ago I recently remade this idea. :)
Gody322 3 years ago I just remade this idea with some changes. :)
Stevethebarbarian 3 years ago Wow, @ymer! You have the wonderful privilege of an empty hand, no turn 2, and five garbage secrets that provide zero tempo!
nutter666 3 years ago Oncoming Storm. Secret: After your opponent plays three minions in a turn, cast Lightning Storm. Overload (2).
Ymer3 years ago Here is the thing with 0 cost secrets. On turn one you can have up to FIVE secrets up. UP TO FIVE! TURN ONE!
Gody322 3 years ago Thanks @Gothe all your suggestions make sense. I think I'll re-post this in a bit with some balance changes. :)
Gothe3 years ago @Gody322 if i could offer some criticism and suggestions to your cards;
Firstly, I like the idea of 0 cost secrets with overload but most of these aren't powerful enough. Hidden Spirits is fine, albeit a bit weak.
Flametounges gift is neat, but I'd either increase the atatck given (to like 4 or something) and make it permanent. Or if you want to stick with 2 attack, gives ALL your minions +2 attack for that turn only.
Lightning Axe can just have it's damage increased to like 4 or mayyyyyybe even 5.
The net two are fine as is, a bit weak but that's fine, your opponent wont see them comming.
Elemental Backlash should have the overload given increased to like 3 or 4.
elemental shift is fine if shamen becomes a heavy elemental class.
Murify is my favorite and most balanced. Like Polymorph potion, except it's almost never going to be a 1/1, making it so you wouldn't want to drop it early game.
Xsenon213 years ago I would also like to see secrets that evolve and devolve.
Gody322 3 years ago I will admit I was really careful (too careful) in not making any of these too good. So I understand they may be a bit under-powered.
Riskiace 3 years ago As people have mentioned hidden spirits as being strong I'll give that as an example, treating this a 1 cost card is compares favourably to lost in the jungle (1 mana for two 1/1s in pally) while this will probably give you around two 1/2s worth of stats (average 6 stats in total) with sight high roll potential making up for the fact it's a secret and the potential slowness of the card. Furthermore, if we were to treat this as a two-mana card (as it should be now) this compares very unfavourably to hat trick (2 mana hunter secret which summons a 4/2 stealth beast when a spell is played) as although it goes wide the upside to hat trick was the fact that although the opponent could control it, the couldn't interact with it first in most situations (I also note this has the potential to go wide but that's on par with the beast synergy that hat trick gave you). I know cross-class balancing isn't the best but considering these were cards from many years ago and power creep, I think it's fair to overload them at 1 instead of 2.
Riskiace 3 years ago Lowkey these would all be fine with overload 1. Although they can be powerful many don't feel like they're balanced around the fact that the opponent can counter them and any good ones are made worse by the rest being bad (as if only one sees play people will know to play around it).
TheFriendlyEnemy 3 years ago Ah, right. Yes, I agree that these are below average in powerlevel. In fact, Lightning Axe, Flametongue's Gift and Spell Snare feel like they were balanced around not having Overload.
Stevethebarbarian 3 years ago Well for clarity's sake, I'm not exactly with Gody. I think every one of these need considerable buffs, some of them need their power more than doubled before anyone would ever consider them.
TheFriendlyEnemy 3 years ago Sorry, @Xarm, but I'm with Gody and Steve here. Your changes are rather bizarre and feel like entirely different cards. You also haven't actually given any justification for changing their cost, other than "I'm scared of 0-Cost cards."
Xarm3 years ago Change the all to cost 1 and Overload 1. I think Overload Shaman could benefit off of quick yet random secret effects. Maybe creating a low mana curve Overload Shaman.
Hidden Spirit Secret: After your opponent cast a spell, or plays a minion, summon a random minion of that cost. Overload: (1)
Flametongue's Gift Secret: When one of your minions is attack, give it +2 attack for each friendly minion. Overload: (1)
Lightning Axes Secret: When an enemy minion attacks your hero deal damage to it, and the enemy hero, equal to that minions attack. Overload: (1)
Delayed Shock Secret: At the end of your opponents turn deal damage to all enemies equal to the number of cards they played this turn. Overload: (1)
Spell Snare Secret: When your opponent cast a spell, it gets delayed for 1 turn. Target is the same, if possible. Otherwise, it's random. Overload: (1)
Elemental Backlash Secret: The next card your opponent plays gains Overload: (2). Overload: (1)All thoughts on beefing them up a bit and getting them out of the scary 0 cost zone.
Stevethebarbarian 3 years ago I absolutely disagree with Xarm in all counts.
Every one of these is pitifully weak. Hidden Spirits is the strongest, and you're paying 2 mana for 2 mana worth of stats, except they're random and may be Dormant for several turns.
As for the others, they're downright pitiful. Flametongue's Gift is paying 2 mana for a 0 mana effect which is temporary and uncontrollable.
Lightning Axe is paying 2 mana for a 0 mana effect that is, again, uncontrollable.
Delayed Shock is paying 2 mana for a 1 mana effect, except it's uncontrollable and slow, letting your opponent do whatever they want before it triggers.
Spell Snare is paying 2 mana for... nothing. Even if this doesn't trigger on spells that are already untargeted, a good number of decks don't even RUN spells that are targeted, and making one spell go wild is just absolutely worthless.
Finally, Elemental Backlash seems like a symmetrical effect, except you're paying 1 card and Overload 2 to, at some point, Overload your opponent without the need for them to lose a card, and it can trigger way later in the game. All of these are paying way, way too much for what they do, and not even a single one would see play. Hidden Spirits is the only one of these that is better than Eye For An Eye.
Xarm3 years ago I don't per say Shaman NEEEEDS Secrets but i like the ideas of what you have except:
1. Costing 0, even with the Overload: 2, they seem way OP. Anything that costs 0 has proven to be trouble time and time again.
Maybe make them cost 1 and Overload: 1?
2. Hidden Spirits...
Even with the Overload, just for opponent casting a spell you get 2 random 1 drops.This feels way OP and makes opponent feels bad in early game where they are very limited interactions and late game that's very lackluster.
How about changing it up a bit?
Hidden Spirit Secret: After your opponent cast a spell or plays a minion summon a random minion of that cost. Overload: (2)
The others seem fine. If you change them to 1 mana and Overload 1 you could maybe beef them up a bit too.
Gody322 3 years ago If you have ideas for other Shaman Secrets feel free to post them. :)
I recently remade this idea. :)
I just remade this idea with some changes. :)
Wow, @ymer! You have the wonderful privilege of an empty hand, no turn 2, and five garbage secrets that provide zero tempo!
Oncoming Storm. Secret: After your opponent plays three minions in a turn, cast Lightning Storm. Overload (2).
Here is the thing with 0 cost secrets. On turn one you can have up to FIVE secrets up. UP TO FIVE! TURN ONE!
Thanks @Gothe all your suggestions make sense. I think I'll re-post this in a bit with some balance changes. :)
@Gody322 if i could offer some criticism and suggestions to your cards;
Firstly, I like the idea of 0 cost secrets with overload but most of these aren't powerful enough. Hidden Spirits is fine, albeit a bit weak.
Flametounges gift is neat, but I'd either increase the atatck given (to like 4 or something) and make it permanent. Or if you want to stick with 2 attack, gives ALL your minions +2 attack for that turn only.
Lightning Axe can just have it's damage increased to like 4 or mayyyyyybe even 5.
The net two are fine as is, a bit weak but that's fine, your opponent wont see them comming.
Elemental Backlash should have the overload given increased to like 3 or 4.
elemental shift is fine if shamen becomes a heavy elemental class.
Murify is my favorite and most balanced. Like Polymorph potion, except it's almost never going to be a 1/1, making it so you wouldn't want to drop it early game.
I added a few more. :)
Oh yeah that's a good idea.
I would also like to see secrets that evolve and devolve.
I will admit I was really careful (too careful) in not making any of these too good. So I understand they may be a bit under-powered.
As people have mentioned hidden spirits as being strong I'll give that as an example, treating this a 1 cost card is compares favourably to lost in the jungle (1 mana for two 1/1s in pally) while this will probably give you around two 1/2s worth of stats (average 6 stats in total) with sight high roll potential making up for the fact it's a secret and the potential slowness of the card. Furthermore, if we were to treat this as a two-mana card (as it should be now) this compares very unfavourably to hat trick (2 mana hunter secret which summons a 4/2 stealth beast when a spell is played) as although it goes wide the upside to hat trick was the fact that although the opponent could control it, the couldn't interact with it first in most situations (I also note this has the potential to go wide but that's on par with the beast synergy that hat trick gave you). I know cross-class balancing isn't the best but considering these were cards from many years ago and power creep, I think it's fair to overload them at 1 instead of 2.
Lowkey these would all be fine with overload 1. Although they can be powerful many don't feel like they're balanced around the fact that the opponent can counter them and any good ones are made worse by the rest being bad (as if only one sees play people will know to play around it).
Ah, right. Yes, I agree that these are below average in powerlevel. In fact, Lightning Axe, Flametongue's Gift and Spell Snare feel like they were balanced around not having Overload.
Well for clarity's sake, I'm not exactly with Gody. I think every one of these need considerable buffs, some of them need their power more than doubled before anyone would ever consider them.
Sorry, @Xarm, but I'm with Gody and Steve here. Your changes are rather bizarre and feel like entirely different cards. You also haven't actually given any justification for changing their cost, other than "I'm scared of 0-Cost cards."
Change the all to cost 1 and Overload 1. I think Overload Shaman could benefit off of quick yet random secret effects. Maybe creating a low mana curve Overload Shaman.
Hidden Spirit
Secret: After your opponent cast a spell, or plays a minion, summon a random minion of that cost. Overload: (1)
Flametongue's Gift
Secret: When one of your minions is attack, give it +2 attack for each friendly minion. Overload: (1)
Lightning Axes
Secret: When an enemy minion attacks your hero deal damage to it, and the enemy hero, equal to that minions attack. Overload: (1)
Delayed Shock
Secret: At the end of your opponents turn deal damage to all enemies equal to the number of cards they played this turn. Overload: (1)
Spell Snare
Secret: When your opponent cast a spell, it gets delayed for 1 turn. Target is the same, if possible. Otherwise, it's random. Overload: (1)
Elemental Backlash
Secret: The next card your opponent plays gains Overload: (2). Overload: (1)All thoughts on beefing them up a bit and getting them out of the scary 0 cost zone.
I absolutely disagree with Xarm in all counts.
Every one of these is pitifully weak. Hidden Spirits is the strongest, and you're paying 2 mana for 2 mana worth of stats, except they're random and may be Dormant for several turns.
As for the others, they're downright pitiful. Flametongue's Gift is paying 2 mana for a 0 mana effect which is temporary and uncontrollable.
Lightning Axe is paying 2 mana for a 0 mana effect that is, again, uncontrollable.
Delayed Shock is paying 2 mana for a 1 mana effect, except it's uncontrollable and slow, letting your opponent do whatever they want before it triggers.
Spell Snare is paying 2 mana for... nothing. Even if this doesn't trigger on spells that are already untargeted, a good number of decks don't even RUN spells that are targeted, and making one spell go wild is just absolutely worthless.
Finally, Elemental Backlash seems like a symmetrical effect, except you're paying 1 card and Overload 2 to, at some point, Overload your opponent without the need for them to lose a card, and it can trigger way later in the game. All of these are paying way, way too much for what they do, and not even a single one would see play. Hidden Spirits is the only one of these that is better than Eye For An Eye.
I don't per say Shaman NEEEEDS Secrets but i like the ideas of what you have except:
1. Costing 0, even with the Overload: 2, they seem way OP. Anything that costs 0 has proven to be trouble time and time again.
Maybe make them cost 1 and Overload: 1?
2. Hidden Spirits...
Even with the Overload, just for opponent casting a spell you get 2 random 1 drops.This feels way OP and makes opponent feels bad in early game where they are very limited interactions and late game that's very lackluster.
How about changing it up a bit?
Hidden Spirit
Secret: After your opponent cast a spell or plays a minion summon a random minion of that cost. Overload: (2)
The others seem fine. If you change them to 1 mana and Overload 1 you could maybe beef them up a bit too.
If you have ideas for other Shaman Secrets feel free to post them. :)
Thoughts?